SEDSAT-2 Meeting Transcript 20070128
From SEDSWiki
Lavina Parwani has joined the conference.
Jayaram Harikrishnan has joined the conference.
Kirk Kittell has joined the conference.
Pradeep Nair has joined the conference.
tolkien97 has joined the conference.
tolkien97: hey hey Pradeep Nair has joined the conference.
Kirk Kittell: hi all
Kirk Kittell: brb tolkien97: k
Pradeep Nair: hi
Lavina Parwani: HI all
Lavina Parwani: wow, full house
aaron5x5 has joined the conference.
tolkien97: hey Lavina
Lavina Parwani: did everyone get my email with the applications as attachments?
Jayaram Harikrishnan: howdy partners
Lavina Parwani: hey jay
tom nordheim: hmmm now I don't think I did
Lavina Parwani: hey geoff
Lavina Parwani: I just sent it to the mailing lists a little bit ago
tom nordheim: ah ok
tom nordheim: I haven't received it yet
Kirk Kittell: I have to pass it to the list... it was too large, so the filter stopped it
aaron5x5: morning
Jayaram Harikrishnan: morning Aaron
Lavina Parwani: oh, ok. Sorry about that Kirk
Lavina Parwani: Hey Aaron
aaron5x5: 7am here
aaron5x5:
Kirk Kittell: no worries, now you should see it
tom nordheim: yep
tolkien97: 9am here
tolkien97: heh
Kirk Kittell: automatically there is a 40kb limit
Lavina Parwani: ah, I see. I could have sent it separately
aaron5x5: can we use voice here?
Jayaram Harikrishnan: i did have som problem seding some attachement to the mailing list too
tom nordheim: no point on my end at least, I don't have a microphone
tolkien97: I have a mic, but I'm in the meeting through gaim which doesn't support voice chat
tolkien97: brb gonna boil water
Kirk Kittell: ha, I heard someone
tolkien97: aw, I'm missing out?!
tolkien97: okay okay, I'll log in to yahoo ;D
aaron5x5: does everyone have speakers?
Lavina Parwani: I don't
tolkien97: oh
tolkien97: lol
Pradeep Nair: no..me neither..
Jayaram Harikrishnan: i do
Jayaram Harikrishnan: have microphone too
tolkien97: no point then
aaron5x5: headphones?
Lavina Parwani: well. speakers yeah, but I'm at a gas station so I won't be able to hear you
tolkien97: haha
aaron5x5: nice
Lavina Parwani: I didn't bring it
Lavina Parwani: I didn't know it was going to be a voice thing
tolkien97: a meeting on the road - literally
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: ok we'll keep it text then
Lavina Parwani: I'm sorry
tom nordheim: should we start then?
Pradeep Nair has joined the conference.
tolkien97: yah
Kirk Kittell: just a second, pradeep is here
Lavina Parwani: hello, pradeep
Kirk Kittell: I don't see him, just a sec
aaron5x5: be back in 5, start without me
Pradeep Nair: hey lavina..
Pradeep Nair: do u see kirk in your sidepane? I think we might be having two chatroooms..I dunno..
Lavina Parwani: I see Kirk
Lavina Parwani: and I see you
tom nordheim: I see him
Jayaram Harikrishnan: i dont see him
tolkien97: I se pradeep and Kirk, and only once
Kirk Kittell: in the meantime...
Kirk Kittell: did you all read the comments?
Pradeep Nair: wait...I'll log out and get back in..
tom nordheim: yes
tolkien97: yeah
Pradeep Nair has left the conference.
tolkien97: the one from Ed Chester was detailed
Lavina Parwani: yes, and yes, but thats a good thing
Kirk Kittell: yeah, Ed is a good guy, and pretty smart, too
tolkien97:
Kirk Kittell: OK, then I want to have all of you post a few comments to the comments
tolkien97: I had a couple of questions/comments about Ed's comments, my first being: What's an STK model?
Kirk Kittell: ahh
Kirk Kittell: www.stk.com
Pradeep Nair has joined the conference.
tom nordheim: they have a free student version I think....
Pradeep Nair: hello all..
tom nordheim: at least I remember seeing that somewhere before
Kirk Kittell: hi Pradeep
Lavina Parwani: Where do we post the comments to the comments?
tom nordheim: yep, the basic edition is free
tom nordheim: http://www.agi.com/products/desktopApp/stkFamily/editions/
tolkien97: err
Lavina Parwani: awesome
tolkien97: but what exactly is it?
tolkien97: *clicks*
Lavina Parwani: analysis software
Kirk Kittell: http://wiki.seds.org/index.php/SEDSAT-2_Mission_Feasibility_Study
tom nordheim: ¨simulation tool for aerospace apps
Kirk Kittell: Appendix B for our comments
Lavina Parwani: there we go
aaron5x5: STK is pretty cool, used a lot in industry
Kirk Kittell: will post their comments in Appendix A
tolkien97: ohhh, simulation tool
tolkien97: nifty Lavina Parwani: alrighty. Do we have a link for Appendix B? Or do we create it?
Kirk Kittell: it is at the bottom
Kirk Kittell: part of the document
Lavina Parwani: awesome. Thanks
Kirk Kittell: so let's do that for a few minutes -- open word or notepad, and make a few comments to include in the appendix
Kirk Kittell: 10 minutes?
tom nordheim: right now?
tom nordheim:
Lavina Parwani: yes
Kirk Kittell: sure, we can spend 10 min writing notes now, then post it after
Pradeep Nair: Kirk, we can do that later...10 mins is precious time in a 1 hr chat session..
tolkien97: another thing about his comments - it's great that he thinks our split cubesat idea is good..he suggests even going as far as a stack of 3.. but wouldn't we be spreading a bit thin at some point? Kirk Kittell: ok Pradeep, good idea
Kirk Kittell: as long as you all promise to do it after the meeting, because we are submitting this for participants today
Pradeep Nair: ok..
tom nordheim: by a stack of three he means three full sized cubesats on top of eachother...no?
Kirk Kittell: yes
tom nordheim: that would again be 3x the price for the launch alone
Kirk Kittell: like ION-1 was a two-cube stack -- it was really the size of two CubeSats, but designed to be one unit
tolkien97: right, okay
Lavina Parwani: I'll have to do it now, then, because I have to go back home in a few minutes. My mom'll flip at me being at a gas station at 11 pm I'm sorry about that
Kirk Kittell: ok after the meeting -- post comments to the reviewer's comments -- basically, how we will use their comments in our project in the future
tolkien97: but ours would "unfold" or separate in space, aye?
Kirk Kittell: that's fine Lavina, tell your mom we all said hello
tolkien97: hehe
Kirk Kittell: no, in that case Geoff they would probably remain attached in space
tom nordheim: mama's girl
tolkien97: aw, how unfun!
tolkien97: hehe
tolkien97: hmm
tolkien97: well, from my notes, what he said was: If you considered a cubesat stack of 3 (i.e. one of your dimensions is 3x as long as standard cubesat but it can be launched in a standard tube launcher) - can this give you multiple booms/extensions - or a really long boom?
tom nordheim: yes inside the 3x cube structure
tom nordheim: like quakesat for example
tolkien97: oh, I thought the boom and such would protrude
Kirk Kittell: yes, it would deploy from the satellite
Kirk Kittell: after it is out of the tube
Kirk Kittell: ok, one point before we go on with this
Kirk Kittell: have you all seen the most recent application?
tolkien97: ahh okay, but the satellite itself would remain as a 1-piece 3x-sized cubesat
tolkien97: I haven't, yet
Kirk Kittell: if you can open your email, let's approve those applications
Lavina Parwani: i'll tell her, Kirk. And yes, Tom
tom nordheim: I think the payload app shouldn't be for being a member of the team
tom nordheim: just for suggesting a payload
tom nordheim: we allready have an application for joining
Pradeep Nair: there are two apps, right? one for payload and other for joining..?
tom nordheim: yes
tom nordheim: I was thinking something more like this...http://wiki.seds.org/index.php/SEDSAT-2_Payload_Application
tom nordheim: and in theory anyone could suggest a payload
tom nordheim: not only team members/prospective team members
tom nordheim: which would be good for us as well...
Lavina Parwani: brb
Kirk Kittell: ah, so even someone who is a professional, but not participating as a student could give a payload idea?
Pradeep Nair: Do you want every student to be attached to a University?
aaron5x5: sounds like Protoforge would work well for things like this
tom nordheim: thaat's why I wrote /other
Pradeep Nair: I mean do you want the University to back the student's project...
Lavina Parwani: brb
tom nordheim: well the form is only for suggesting a payload
tom nordheim: in theory someone could suggest something but not even be involved in actually implementing it
aaron5x5: just suggest it as a requirement
aaron5x5: in protoforge
aaron5x5: then project members vote on whether or not it becomes the law
Kirk Kittell: sounds good -- both Tom and Aaron
Pradeep Nair: aah, democracy?
aaron5x5: did you guys get a notifications for the requirement I finalized?
tolkien97: in protoforge?
aaron5x5: yes
Lavina Parwani: yes
tolkien97: yup
aaron5x5: if you go to the link
Pradeep Nair: hold on, will check..
aaron5x5: and follow it to the requirement
aaron5x5: whoever gets there first, vote yes or no on it
Lavina Parwani: and I like your payload app better, Tom. the one I made was based on what was there last week
Pradeep Nair: Aaron: this one? - SEDSat2 shall incorporate measures to promote collaboration from participants distributed around the planet Earth.
aaron5x5: that's the one
Kirk Kittell: there is a small link that you can follow to vote, it looks like ">>"
aaron5x5: yeah I use >> a lot
aaron5x5:
aaron5x5: then once at the details page for the requirement
aaron5x5: there's a "Vote" link in the action menu at the top
aaron5x5: Pradeep's got it
Jayaram Harikrishnan: reaaly a great idea
tolkien97: looking over the application form now
aaron5x5: 2 more votes and it'll be part of the baseline for the system
Pradeep Nair: yeah, I just need that first nudge..
tolkien97: hang on, hang on
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: can always request a change to the baseline later
tom nordheim: wait....ok kind of lost for a moment there, just signed up..
aaron5x5: but baselined requirements are what everyone on the team should work to until they are changed
tom nordheim: we are voting for what?
aaron5x5: nordheim86 I see you on there
aaron5x5: go to the sedsat-2 project
tom nordheim: yeh
aaron5x5: and join it to become a member
Pradeep Nair: Aaron, I missed a couple of things that were baselined...is there some place where we can check out which are the baselined and what are not..
aaron5x5: then go to the requirements
tom nordheim: yeah
aaron5x5: the top one says "Finalized"
aaron5x5: go to the options menu and click "details"
aaron5x5: then vote
tom nordheim: k
aaron5x5: I see your vote
aaron5x5: one more to baseline
tolkien97: so, is there more than one application form I should be looking at?
Pradeep Nair: ok Aaron, found that...
tolkien97: I see the one in Word
tolkien97: hmm, and payload in the wiki, and the protoforge one?
Pradeep Nair: the protoforge voting is for the overall project..
Pradeep Nair: while the word docs in the email is the team application forms....
Pradeep Nair: which is not in Protoforge.....yet....
aaron5x5: I can allow Word document uploads on Protoforge
aaron5x5: they aren't allowed right now
aaron5x5: there is a 2MB limit however
aaron5x5: Jay, that was the problem with the PDF file earlier
Jayaram Harikrishnan: ya it was
aaron5x5: I've asked Chris to bump it up to 10 MB
Jayaram Harikrishnan: then that should be fine i guess
tolkien97: I've looked at the Word ones and they're fine..checking protoforge and the wiki now
tolkien97: hmm
Pradeep Nair: Kirk, we're allowed to load files onto the blog...
Pradeep Nair: SEDS blog that is..
tom nordheim: ok so are we deciding on the applications now?
Kirk Kittell: yes
tolkien97: SEDSat2 shall incorporate measures to promote collaboration from participants distributed around the planet Earth.
tolkien97: *chuckle*
Pradeep Nair: upto 10mb and attached to one blog post..though..
tolkien97: [..] "around the world" could have done nicely, it's cute though
Kirk Kittell: yeah we won't use that for this ap, pradeep
tom nordheim: ok as I said I think that the payload app should be more like the one I posted on the wiki, since we already have one for joining the team...
tolkien97: so how do I vote in proto?
Pradeep Nair: we won't have all this trouble if we had a website, would we?
Pradeep Nair: do we have one?
tolkien97: we have the wiki
Kirk Kittell: we ill
Kirk Kittell: we will -- www.seds.org/sedsat2
Kirk Kittell: but not up yet
tolkien97: remember that the wiki is just sofware, we could use the seds server for other stuff
aaron5x5: there's a vote link near the top
Pradeep Nair: can't we just make load it there and link to it?
tolkien97: right, and seds.org/sedsat2
tolkien97: lol
aaron5x5: Alright! We've got our first baselined requirement
aaron5x5: excellent
tolkien97: haha
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: now the only way to change it is to submit a change request
tolkien97: what does Remove in the Link List do?
tolkien97: I clicked that not knowing what it was
tolkien97: be nice, I just woke up ;p
aaron5x5: The link list is there to make it easier to
link things in textfields
aaron5x5: so use it kind of like a "favorites" in your browser
aaron5x5: "remove" will remove the selected links from your linklist
tolkien97: I have no idea what I removed
tolkien97: heh
tolkien97: but the page changed, or at least it looked like it did
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: was there anything in your list?
aaron5x5: it helps to have something there first
aaron5x5: lol
aaron5x5: Click on the Link>> on a requirement or something else to add it to your linklist
aaron5x5: The idea of Protoforge is that you suggest requirements for the system
aaron5x5: so if you guys have ideas of what the satellite should do
tolkien97: oh, I think it was empty
tolkien97: *shrug*
aaron5x5: you can add a requirement in the requirement tree
aaron5x5: and then talk about it with everyone
Pradeep Nair: ok
aaron5x5: then if it seems like that's what you want
tolkien97: I suggest that it should clean my apartment
aaron5x5: finalize and baseline it
tolkien97: all in favour, say aye!
tolkien97: Aye!
Pradeep Nair: so, that's why the discussion forum..
aaron5x5: it only works if everyone agrees to adhere by it
aaron5x5: requirements are law
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: yes Pradeep
aaron5x5: if you can keep your discussion associated with the requirement you are talking about
Pradeep Nair: democracy..!!!I have to vote on 1st for Corporation elections..
aaron5x5: then that information is easy to find later
aaron5x5: I wasn't sure if Vote was the right thing to call it when I wrote the software
aaron5x5: usually in business it's called "Approve"
aaron5x5:
Pradeep Nair: hey guys, sorry but I have to leave too...will consult the chat notes...
tolkien97: I prefer Vote
tom nordheim: so do I
Pradeep Nair has left the conference.
tolkien97: the reason behind "Approve" is to give it a psychological spin
tolkien97: heh
tolkien97: I hate that companies play mind games like that
tolkien97: but anyway
aaron5x5: true, that's good to hear I actually struggled with that decision for a couple days
aaron5x5:
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: speaking of
aaron5x5: Protoforge is a work in progress
aaron5x5: I go to great lengths to make sure data does not get corrupt
aaron5x5: but sometimes there are bugs in the web page
aaron5x5: if you guys need anything added or have any suggestions I'd love to hear them
tom nordheim: Can I make a suggestion, just in case I have to leave earlier...
tom nordheim: that we always decide on the next meeting before we call it a day...
aaron5x5: sure
tom nordheim: so that we avoid the confusion regarding the meetings we have had lately
tom nordheim: either that or having them at the same time each week
Kirk Kittell: let's move it up one hour -- 13:00 GMT
tolkien97: I personally would like to stick to the sundays at 14:00GMT, everyone was used to that
tolkien97: gah
tolkien97: heh
tom nordheim: I vote for that Sunday at 1300GMT
tom nordheim: if we get sundays at 1300, Mike can attend
tolkien97: oh
tolkien97: right
tolkien97: okay then, for Mike
tolkien97:
aaron5x5: works for me, 6am is just like 7am in my book
Kirk Kittell: yeah, that was a request for Lavina
aaron5x5: Is everyone OK with using the Protoforge Meetings as the place to schedule SEDSat-2 meetings?
tom nordheim: we should remember to update the wiki as well
aaron5x5: I think Kirk deleted the wiki meetings
tom nordheim: ok
tolkien97: deleted them?
tolkien97: the transcripts?
Kirk Kittell: I moved them
Kirk Kittell: there's a link on the SEDSAT-2 Meeting Notes
aaron5x5: Somebody schedule the next meeting
Kirk Kittell: Sunday 13GMT?
tom nordheim: I'll do it, I want to try this protoforge thing
aaron5x5: Kirk, I think "Sunday 13GMT!" is more correct
aaron5x5: lol
aaron5x5: cool
aaron5x5: Feel free to schedule things like office hours on there too
tolkien97: personally, I've started using Google Calendar quite a bit
tolkien97: and I included the SEDSat-2 calendar into my google widget Kirk Kittell: k
aaron5x5: if you know you'll be working at a certain time you can put it in there
tolkien97: calendar widget*
tom nordheim: ok createed
tom nordheim: -e
tolkien97: so I see all my events and SEDSat2 events on the same interface
tolkien97: it's nifty
aaron5x5: Tom you can invite us all to it as well
aaron5x5: Google Calendar is pretty cool
tom nordheim: k,l getting the hang of this now
tom nordheim: eh strike that
aaron5x5: I'm thinking it's nice to keep everything for a project in one place
tom nordheim: unable to deliver notification...?
tom nordheim: Unable to insert notification.
aaron5x5: it makes life easier, especially for people who join later on
tom nordheim: when I try to invite everyone
tom nordheim: what's going on here?
aaron5x5: crap, I'll look into it
aaron5x5: that's relatively new code
tom nordheim: what have you written it in?
tom nordheim: (just curious)
aaron5x5: PHP
aaron5x5: with MySQL backend
aaron5x5: and a sprinkling of ajax
Kirk Kittell: remember to add your comments now
Kirk Kittell: to the report
tolkien97: eh, the meeting isn't already over is it?
tolkien97: I got interrupted by others IMing me :S
Kirk Kittell: yes
tolkien97: what's the International System of Units (SI?)
tolkien97: ?
Kirk Kittell: metric
tolkien97: oh, lol
tolkien97: good, I like metric
tom nordheim: civlized units
tolkien97: smirk
tom nordheim: *civilized
tolkien97: *votes For*
aaron5x5: There's been talk of developing the new moon capsule in SI
tolkien97: aaron, you should consider putting notifications and other lists in sortable chronological order..and with page views (to avoid scrolling)
tom nordheim: I don't people in the US use SI when they're doing engineering/science?
tom nordheim: -I
tolkien97: rather, reverse chronological order, but sortable
aaron5x5: great suggestion! I'll add it to the list
aaron5x5: thanks
tolkien97: np
aaron5x5: Keep 'em coming
aaron5x5: Oh yeah
aaron5x5: you can do that
aaron5x5: just click on the "Created" or "Title" headings
tolkien97: right, so, where's the application forms in protoforge?
aaron5x5: it'll resort them
tom nordheim: have we decided on those now then?
tolkien97: I've gone through my list of user notifications and deleted a bunch of em, heh
tolkien97: I haven't seem the protoforge ones yet
aaron5x5: I don't think there are any protoforge ones
tolkien97: I do like the idea of ideas being put in easily through a web interface rather than in a word form, though, psychologically speaking (from my own experience as well), people tend to put filler or nothing in fields they don't know how to answer... whereas people tend to fill out Word forms properly
tolkien97: or, well, you know what I mean tolkien97: aaron?
aaron5x5: yeah
tolkien97: where're the protoforge forms
tolkien97: for application & payload
aaron5x5: they're only on the wiki
Kirk Kittell: there are no protoforge forms for application and payload
tolkien97: ohhh
tolkien97: I had understood that there were
tolkien97: nm then
tolkien97: there's an application form in the wiki? I only saw payload
tom nordheim: there are two
tom nordheim: http://wiki.seds.org/index.php/SEDSAT-2_Team_Application
tom nordheim: http://wiki.seds.org/index.php/SEDSAT-2_Team_Application
tom nordheim: http://wiki.seds.org/index.php/SEDSAT-2_Payload_Application
tolkien97: thanks much
tolkien97: hmmm
tolkien97: You know..
tolkien97: you know how you can add subject lines with e-mail links?
tolkien97: maybe we could put the entire form(s) (or a rough layout for the user) in the link
tolkien97: it would be a lengthy ugly link..but it might work
tom nordheim: some users might not have an email client
tom nordheim: I don't use one
tolkien97: oh okay
tolkien97: well, the link still only displays the e-mail address
tom nordheim: feel free to change it
tom nordheim: it's a wiki
tolkien97: but the link itself would be mailto:international@seds.org?subject=Team%20Application ..etc
tolkien97: heh
tolkien97:
tolkien97: yah
tolkien97: that'd be one FUGLY and irritating to alter "form" though
tolkien97: lol
tom nordheim: perhaps we should call it a day?
aaron5x5: I'm on my way out here
tolkien97: we could make the Word version available along-side the wiki one
aaron5x5: Glad to finally get a chance to make it to a meeting
tom nordheim: they're different
tom nordheim: oh you mean making a word version available of the wiki app?
tolkien97: yeah
tolkien97: the word versions made by Lavina
aaron5x5: See you guys next time
tom nordheim: but they are different from the ones on the wiki
Aaron Schultz has left the conference.
Jayaram Harikrishnan: Thanks araon
tom nordheim: well the payload one is...
tolkien97: the questions may be a tad different, but one could be adapted to the other
tom nordheim: hey Kirk are you there?
Kirk Kittell: still here, sorry
Kirk Kittell: but away at the same time...
tom nordheim: what do you think?
Kirk Kittell: what was the question?
tom nordheim: about the applications...still
tolkien97: heh
tolkien97: sorry, I was distracted by 2 people IMing me in the middle of our meeting :S
tolkien97: yeah, if the word & wiki versions are different (in content, not intent), we could alter the team applications in wiki & word format to have the same questions
tolkien97: same for payload
tom nordheim: ok I'm leaving now, Geoff could you adapt the wiki one to look like the wod one ?
tolkien97: and offer a link to the Word version on the wiki pages
Kirk Kittell: I can post the word one
tom nordheim: *word
tolkien97: sure
tom nordheim: ok, I'll see you guys next week then(I really have to go). Kirk I'll add some comments to the appendix later today
tom nordheim: saving the conv to the wiki now...
tom nordheim: have a nice week all!
